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>From: "Perry E. Metzger" <pmetzger@lehman.com>
>>From: plmoses@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu

>Paul L. Moses says:
>> 
>> This may be a semantic point, but it should be made....  David
>> Koontz sez: "Avoiding the appearance of endorsing the violent
>> overthrow of government is prudent policy..."  Um...I think I know
>> what you mean, but isn't it better to just say outright that
>> violence really is not the way to reform government at all, save in
>> truly historical, exceptional cases (American Revolution, French
>> Revolution...)

>I'm not sure either of those cases truly succeeded, either.

>Myself, I feel that no good can be accomplished by initiating force
>against others, no matter what the cause. Violent revolutions go
>completely against my grain. Any sorts of reforms that will stick are
>going to have to arise peacefully. This is not to say, of course, that
>they will necessarily arise via the "democratic process". The
>government may simply find itself outflanked, for instance. (Imagine
>as an example if the government realized tomorrow that allowing
>citizens to know how to read would be dangerous -- its a little late
>to stop it, so they will never do anything about that.)

Two points of clarification:

1) I do not now, nor have I in the past advocated the violent overthrow
   of any domestic government.  I am also opposed to the overthrow of
   foreign governments on moral grounds.

2) The necessity to distance ones self or organization (as may have occured
   in the case of the Libertarian Party) from what should be in effect
   an expression of free speech, smacks of McCarthyistic opression.

(this was what was hidden beneath the cynicism and 'waffle')

Thanks for rising to the occasion.

----
A country that can have a McCarthy Era has no business giving more power
to its government.

> 1) I do not now, nor have I in the past advocated the violent overthrow
>    of any domestic government.  I am also opposed to the overthrow of
>    foreign governments on moral grounds.

I find it interesting that the United States was formed via the venue of
armed rebellion, but disqualifies anyone from public service who advocates
the same.  As a friend says, "the first thing the revolutionary government
does when they get in power is to ... ban all revolutions!"

It is also interesting to note that Jefferson, Paine, and others of the era
advocated, even supported, the right of the people to overthrow an oppressive
government, even their own.
-- 
Ed Carp, N7EKG			erc@apple.com			510/659-9560
                            anon-2133@twwells.com
If you want magic, let go of your armor.  Magic is so much stronger than
steel!        -- Richard Bach, "The Bridge Across Forever"

Having a revolution and then banning revolutions is nothing new. 
Read Machiaveli's (sp) _The Prince_.  After winning a revolution, his first
instruction is to kill the general that won it, because he has the power to win one again.
-- 
PGP 2.3 Key by finger