Re: meaningless rumor

From a high-level source in contact with an *extremely* high
	 level source:

	 Rumor: Moby Crypto was targeted because G. Ward intended to
	 include PGP on distribution disks. The investigation is
	 primarily PGP oriented, and G. Ward is just a bystander who
	 got caught up. PRZ & PGP is the essential target.

	 Notes

	 (1)  phrasing of the subpoenas definitely confirms this -- PGP
	 is mentioned in both.

	 (2) can we find any Usenet postings where G. Ward announced
	 intent to distribute PGP with Moby Crypto to help confirm
	 this?

Ward posted a note that (in essence) asked for help in evading the ITARs.
(Well, I suppose it could have been someone forging a posting...).  He
went so far as to offer to provide mailing labels to someone abroad who
would redistribute Moby Crypto, though from a country where that would
be legal -- but never said how the first copy would get to the trans-
shipment point.  Some reasons were given why this sequence was going to
be technically legal -- but if you were a U.S. attorney investigating
the export of cryptographic software, it's the sort of thing that almost
has to be investigated.  Face it -- if Ward *wanted* to generate a test
case, he couldn't have done a much better job; a private note to the
authorities could have been ``misfiled'', but an announcement to tens
of thousands of readers around the world?  C'mon -- they may or may not
be stupid, and they may or may not be paranoid, but their entire raison
d'etre is to wield power, and Grady just slapped that authority in the
face.  Spitting at your local traffic cop would have been a lot safer.

As for PKP -- *somehow*, it wandered out of the U.S.  Probably, someone
in power decided that that finally needed investigating in detail, to see
if a law was broken.  And Sternlight is right -- if they decide to indict,
they may throw in charges of importing IDEA, though I doubt that they'd
indict just on those grounds; in an era of key escrow, they'd certainly
like a court to rule they had the power to exclude subversive foreign
crypto....


		--Steve Bellovin

....
>they may throw in charges of importing IDEA, though I doubt that they'd
>indict just on those grounds; in an era of key escrow, they'd certainly
>like a court to rule they had the power to exclude subversive foreign
>crypto....
.....
>		--Steve Bellovin

Steve,

Assuming that whoevever implemented PGP did not himself import the cipher, but
based the implementation on the EUROCRYPT '90 paper that was 'imported'
by Springer-Verlag, I don't understand what the basis would be for such a
charge.  Now an indictment against Springer for shipping the proceedings
(which contained C source code for IDEA) into the US - that would be
interesting...

-matt

> Assuming that whoevever implemented PGP did not himself import the
> cipher, but based the implementation on the EUROCRYPT '90 paper
> that was 'imported' by Springer-Verlag, I don't understand what
> the basis would be for such a charge.  Now an indictment against
> Springer for shipping the proceedings (which contained C source
> code for IDEA) into the US - that would be interesting...

Wait a minute.  Does ITAR actuall prohibit importing crypto _to_
the US? I've never heard of it being used this way.


brad

> Wait a minute.  Does ITAR actuall prohibit importing crypto _to_
> the US? I've never heard of it being used this way.

Most of the interpretation that I have heard, including an
interpretation from Jim Bidzos, say that crypto imports _INTO_ the US
are LEGAL, unless that piece of crypto was *illegally* exported from
the US first.

So, if A was illegally exported, you cannot import it and expect it to
be legal.  However, if it was developed outside the US, you can
legally bring it into the US, according to this interpretation.

David Sternlight has a different opinion.  (Which I'm sure he'd gladly
fill you mailbox explaining :-).

-derek

         Derek Atkins, SB '93 MIT EE, G MIT Media Laboratory
     Secretary, MIT Student Information Processing Board (SIPB)
         PGP key available from pgp-public-keys@pgp.mit.edu
            warlord@MIT.EDU       PP-ASEL        N1NWH

> if a law was broken.  And Sternlight is right -- if they decide to indict,
> they may throw in charges of importing IDEA ...

THERE IS NO LAW AGAINST THE IMPORT OF CRYPTOGRAPHY!

How many times does this idiocy have to be squashed?

	John

PS:  I heard a rumor it's against the law to breathe.