[ANSWER] NIST's ftp site

Thanks to all who responded to my question.

The answer is:  csrc.ncsl.nist.gov

Also, apparently, source for DES was in Appendix A of the file  
"/pub/nistpubs/fips181.txt".  However, it was removed and replaced with  
the following:

                                                 Appendix A

This section contained a listing of the source code referenced in the
Automated Password Generator Standard.  This section is not available
in electronic form.

Complete copies of FIPS 181, including this appendix, may be purchased
in hardcopy from the National Technical Information Service (NTIS) via
mail or telephone.

	National Technical Information Service
	U.S. Department of Commerce
	5285 Port Royal Road 

	Springfield, VA 22161
	(703) 487-4650

	Order by FIPSPUB181
	Price: $22.50

(Same address and phone number for discount prices on quantity orders.)

--------------

I wonder if they'll ship to an address outside of the US or Canada?  I  
wonder if the people who package and mail the stuff even look at it?

Jim_Miller@suite.com

> Thanks to all who responded to my question.
> 
> The answer is:  csrc.ncsl.nist.gov
> 
> Also, apparently, source for DES was in Appendix A of the file  
> "/pub/nistpubs/fips181.txt".  However, it was removed and replaced with  
> the following:
>... 

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

If you are in the U.S. or Canada you can get the unexpurgated version
from ftp.wimsey.bc.ca:

/pub/crypto//software/dist/US_or_Canada_only_XXXXXXXX/FIPS181/

- -rw-r--r--   1 markh    user       28214 Mar 01 14:23 fips181.txt.gz
- -rw-r--r--   1 markh    user       28184 Apr 14 14:40 word.c.gz

get the following two files.

word.c is a version that actually compiles. The original code in 
FIPS 181 needed a few cosmetic changes to actually compile correctly.

(usual mechanism with the XXXXXXXX, cd /pub/crypto/software and get
the file README. If you agree to the terms, follow the instructions)

Mark

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iQBVAgUBLf+CDmrJdmD9QWqxAQFafQH/dcemKhwZwNbPprQ+MGRr5omo9yBrvdR3
gZR7Hczy7L1JYBH+OdoDDgvEbNs8o3e99dpaE5v61pUJT2VVRa00jg==
=iXvu
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

> Thanks to all who responded to my question.

> The answer is:  csrc.ncsl.nist.gov

> Also, apparently, source for DES was in Appendix A of the file  
> "/pub/nistpubs/fips181.txt".  However, it was removed and replaced with  
> the following:

It wasn't/isn't the only ftp site in US that has fips181.txt available.
There are other sites that still have the information.
Besides I doubt that anyone would having problems finding sources of DES
they are all over the net (in and out of US). Clearly ITAR fails so be
happy.

[stuff deleted]

> I wonder if they'll ship to an address outside of the US or Canada?  I  
> wonder if the people who package and mail the stuff even look at it?

Why bother just find it on another site, there are plenty out there.

> Jim_Miller@suite.com

-- 
+---------------------+--------------------------------------------------+
|  ____       ___     | Justin Lister                 ruf@cs.uow.edu.au  |
| |    \\   /\ __\    |     Center for Computer Security Research        |
| | |) / \_/ / |_     | Dept. Computer Science      voice: 61-42-835-114 |
| |  _ \\   /| _/     | University of Wollongong      fax: 61-42-214-329 |
| |_/ \/ \_/ |_| (tm) |     Computer Security a utopian dream...         |
|                     |  LiNuX - the only justification for using iNTeL  |
+---------------------+--------------------------------------------------+

> It wasn't/isn't the only ftp site in US that has fips181.txt available.
> There are other sites that still have the information.
> Besides I doubt that anyone would having problems finding sources of DES
> they are all over the net (in and out of US). 
> Clearly ITAR fails so be happy.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ - blatant statements tend to get flamed so
I thought I should follow up a little.

What I mean is it clear that ITAR fails to stop the exporting of crypto (for
the individual). We have seen many examples when code has already found its
way outside the US, before it even becomes availiable to many machines in
the US (PGP,RSAREF,...). Also *most* algorithms developed in the US are 
documented extensively in text that is also available outside (with conference
proceedings, journals, etc), it is just a matter of writting the code.

Clearly if ITAR was to work it would require text exports to be banned as well.

From what I see, ITAR is only slight inconvience to the non-US individual, 
whereas it is also a major thorn to US software developers that can't 
release single versions of software containing crypto, in that they have to 
have US and Rest-of-World versions, ala PGP (unless they develop the software
outside of the US ?).

-- 
+---------------------+--------------------------------------------------+
|  ____       ___     | Justin Lister                 ruf@cs.uow.edu.au  |
| |    \\   /\ __\    |     Center for Computer Security Research        |
| | |) / \_/ / |_     | Dept. Computer Science      voice: 61-42-835-114 |
| |  _ \\   /| _/     | University of Wollongong      fax: 61-42-214-329 |
| |_/ \/ \_/ |_| (tm) |     Computer Security a utopian dream...         |
|                     |  LiNuX - the only justification for using iNTeL  |
+---------------------+--------------------------------------------------+

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In list.cypherpunks you write:

> Thanks to all who responded to my question.
> 
> The answer is:  csrc.ncsl.nist.gov
> 
> Also, apparently, source for DES was in Appendix A of the file  
> "/pub/nistpubs/fips181.txt".  However, it was removed and replaced with  
> the following:

I have a copy of FIPS181 with Appendix A intact.  I can mail a copy if
you like.

(as an aside to the Cypherpunks list, if there's a demand, I'll make it
available on my mail server)
- -- 
Roy M. Silvernail, writing from roy@sendai.cybrspc.mn.org
        "Anything but Nixon, man... a blender.  Anything!"
                       -- National Lampoon, when they were funny

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RMGZi1yOpGCE+82Kp990NltUGK/5AiQmlZAerpYUPIczwgg/YwWyOQHylwXGClKE
kp3qn6mkAkQ=
=JKho
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> 
> 
> Thanks to all who responded to my question.
> 
> The answer is:  csrc.ncsl.nist.gov
> 
> Also, apparently, source for DES was in Appendix A of the file  
> "/pub/nistpubs/fips181.txt".  However, it was removed and replaced with  
> the following:

	Did anyone actually grab it while it was around? If it's still 
available anywhere, i'd appreciate a tip-off...

--
*       *       Mikolaj J. Habryn
                dichro@tartarus.uwa.edu.au
    *           "I'm just another sniper on the information super-highway."
                PGP Public key available by finger
    *           #include <standard-disclaimer.h>