"Only on the Cypherpunks list..."

At 10:00 PM 7/25/95, Nathaniel Borenstein wrote:

>Well, only on the cypherpunks list would you be likely to find general
>agreement that PGP'ed credit card numbers are "easier" than First
>Virtual.  Many thousands of extremely naive net citizens are now happy
>FV customers, and I seriously doubt that most of them could master PGP
>without a full-day tutorial.  (We're not talking about rocket scientists
>here, folks.)

A lot of truth here...sometimes the perfect is the enemy of the good.

After all, only on the Cypherpunks list would you be likely to find general
agreement that setting up a separate Intel box running Linux so one can
create a suitable mail client is the preferred way to do secure e-mail?

(Smileys for the :=)-impaired...I have nothing against Linux, and even
browsed the new O'Reilly book recently. But I'm _still_ glad I'm "just a
Mac user.")

I have no idea what First Virtual's current or future business plans are,
but I do expect more solid encryption, a la PGP or "real" RSA (licensed),
will be coming soon. I assume FV is planning for this likely development.

--Tim May

..........................................................................
Timothy C. May         | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@sensemedia.net   | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
408-728-0152           | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Corralitos, CA         | black markets, collapse of governments.
Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available.
"National borders are just speed bumps on the information superhighway."

On Tue, 25 Jul 1995, Timothy C. May wrote:

> (Smileys for the :=)-impaired...I have nothing against Linux, and even
> browsed the new O'Reilly book recently. But I'm _still_ glad I'm "just a
> Mac user.")

Well you know there is a Mac version of Linux -- not sure if it's 
available for PPC yet.  there also is/was a version of FreeBSD a while 
back too.  (Don't know any details as I haven't done this myself yet.)

You could just add another hard drive and run Linux off of it, or install 
it on a SyQuest cartridge and set the startup disk to point to your 
SyQuest drive.  If you want Linux, start up with the cart.  If you don't, 
startup without it, or with the drive off.

Then you can have the best of both. >;-)

=================================================================93=======
 + ^ + |  Ray Arachelian | Amerika: The land of the Freeh. | \-_    _-/  |
  \|/  |sunder@escape.com| Where day by day, yet another   |  \  --  /   |
<--+-->|                 | Constitutional right vanishes.  |6 _\-  -/_  6|
  /|\  |    Just Say     |                                 |----\  /---- | 
 + v + | "No" to the NSA!| Jail the censor, not the author!|     \/      |
=======/---------------------------------------------------------VI------/
      /  I watched and weeped as the Exon bill passed, knowing that yet /
     / another freedom vanished before my eyes.  How soon before we see/
    /a full scale dictatorship in the name of decency? While the rest /
   /of_the_world_fights_FOR_freedom,_our_gov'ment_fights_our_freedom_/

Ray Arachelian writes:
> Well you know there is a Mac version of Linux -- not sure if it's 
> available for PPC yet.  there also is/was a version of FreeBSD a while 
> back too.  (Don't know any details as I haven't done this myself yet.)

NetBSD, not FreeBSD. There is also MachTen.

.pm

Excerpts from mail: 27-Jul-95 Re: "Only on the Cypherpunk.. "Perry E.
Metzger"@imsi. (292)

> NetBSD, not FreeBSD. There is also MachTen.

Yes, I can attest to the fact that MachTen is *amazing*, particularly
its seamless integration of the Mac and UNIX file systems.  It's worth
getting it even if the only thing you ever use it for is to do "find"
and "grep" through your Macintosh files.....
--------
Nathaniel S. Borenstein <nsb@fv.com>    |           When privacy is outlawed,
Chief Scientist, First Virtual Holdings |     only outlaws will have privacy!
FAQ & PGP key: nsb+faq@nsb.fv.com       | SUPPORT THE ZIMMERMAN DEFENSE FUND!

---VIRTUAL YELLOW RIBBON-->> zldf@clark.net <http://www.netresponse.com/zldf>

On Thu, 27 Jul 1995, Perry E. Metzger wrote:

> Ray Arachelian writes:
> > Well you know there is a Mac version of Linux -- not sure if it's 
> > available for PPC yet.  there also is/was a version of FreeBSD a while 
> > back too.  (Don't know any details as I haven't done this myself yet.)
> 
> NetBSD, not FreeBSD. There is also MachTen.

Thanks. :-)  MachTen though isn't freeware as Linux is. :-)  The problem 
I have with it is that it's a hosted OS and as such is limited to the 
Mac's problems.  i.e. - lack of true preemptive multi-tasking and 
protected memory.  Though the M680x0 series and all Mac motherboards can 
support both preemption and protected memory, Apple in its grand wisdom 
(or lack thereof?) is only now writing it into the next version of it's OS.

Other than that I love the Mac. :-)

=================================================================93=======
 + ^ + |  Ray Arachelian | Amerika: The land of the Freeh. | \-_    _-/  |
  \|/  |sunder@escape.com| Where day by day, yet another   |  \  --  /   |
<--+-->|                 | Constitutional right vanishes.  |6 _\-  -/_  6|
  /|\  |    Just Say     |                                 |----\  /---- | 
 + v + | "No" to the NSA!| Jail the censor, not the author!|     \/      |
=======/---------------------------------------------------------VI------/
      /  I watched and weeped as the Exon bill passed, knowing that yet /
     / another freedom vanished before my eyes.  How soon before we see/
    /a full scale dictatorship in the name of decency? While the rest /
   /of_the_world_fights_FOR_freedom,_our_gov'ment_fights_our_freedom_/

Excerpts from mail: 25-Jul-95 "Only on the Cypherpunks li.. Timothy C.
May@sensemedi (1596*)

> I have no idea what First Virtual's current or future business plans are,
> but I do expect more solid encryption, a la PGP or "real" RSA (licensed),
> will be coming soon. I assume FV is planning for this likely development.

Well, one thing we've announced in public is that if/when Visa and
MasterCard actually announce the encryption standard that they have said
they're going to define, we will support it.  Basically, our attitude
towards encryption has been that the lack of widely-agreed-upon
standards and lack of widespread deployment were show-stoppers for
large-scale commerce.  Our hope is that if Visa & MC agree on a format,
it won't have those problems.  We didn't think that FV itself had enough
clout to set an encryption standard for the world, nor did we see enough
of a bandwagon behind the current PGP format (or any others).  So we
concentrated on making commerce work without encryption, building up our
customer base, our customer service department, and so forth.  We're
promising our sellers as smooth a transition to the eventual standards
as we can possibly manage...  -- Nathaniel
--------
Nathaniel S. Borenstein <nsb@fv.com>    |           When privacy is outlawed,
Chief Scientist, First Virtual Holdings |     only outlaws will have privacy!
FAQ & PGP key: nsb+faq@nsb.fv.com       | SUPPORT THE ZIMMERMAN DEFENSE FUND!

---VIRTUAL YELLOW RIBBON-->> zldf@clark.net <http://www.netresponse.com/zldf>