Internet traffic is monitored.

Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 10:03:11 -0700
X-Sender: bstout@osc.hidata.com
To: Firewalls@GreatCircle.COM, Return requested <firewalls@GreatCircle.COM>
From: Bill Stout <bill.stout@hidata.com>
Subject: Re: Encryption Technology
Sender: firewalls-owner@GreatCircle.COM

At 09:05 PM 5/22/96 -0700, Michael Dillon wrote:
>...
>RTFM
><SNIP - Other literary content deleted>

On the Encryption note, and I swear not along the lines of the 'DOJ' 
and 'FBI Snooping' Big-Brother events, I heard another story recently.

# begin story

A person working on the MBONE project did an unannounced experiment
across the internet using Triple-DES for MBONE, and the very next day, 
'ATF' agents knocked on his door and warned him against exporting 
munitions.  The experimentor was shaken by the fact that agents 
approached him so quickly after the experiment.

# end story

Extrapolations of fact:
   1.   Internet traffic is monitored.
   2.   The ability to snoop for encrypted traffic is present
   3.   The ability to identify encryption levels is present
        (How else can they differentiate DES-1 from DES-3?)
   4.   The ability to crack DES-1 in near real-time mode is present.
        (See above).
   5.   If above=true, then Feds dropping the Zimmerman PGP case probably
        also points to it also being crackable in a similar manner.
   6.   Using encryption only flags traffic for capture and decryption, 
        using strong encryption makes you all that more interesting.

Sorry, couldn't resist.  I'll try not to start a threads about 
electro-plasma propulsion craft at Area 51, metallic-ceramic skin 
and pulse-jets on the Aurora spy plane, heat-imaging video cameras 
on satellites and planes that can watch you through your houses' roof, 
etc.  :)

Bill

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On Wed, 29 May 1996, Anonymous wrote:

> # begin story
> 
> A person working on the MBONE project did an unannounced experiment
> across the internet using Triple-DES for MBONE, and the very next day, 
> 'ATF' agents knocked on his door and warned him against exporting 
> munitions.  The experimentor was shaken by the fact that agents 
> approached him so quickly after the experiment.
> 
> # end story

Do you have any information to back this up?  It sounds like an urban myth.
Also, AFAIK the ATF isn't the agency that controls arms exports.

> 
> Extrapolations of fact:
>    1.   Internet traffic is monitored.

Maybe.  But I doubt that the above story is true.

>    2.   The ability to snoop for encrypted traffic is present

And how exactly is this done?  Unless data is tagged with a header, encrypted
traffic is indistinguishable from random data.

>    3.   The ability to identify encryption levels is present
>         (How else can they differentiate DES-1 from DES-3?)

Same as above.

>    4.   The ability to crack DES-1 in near real-time mode is present.
>         (See above).

Several years ago, the cost of building a DES cracking machine was $100 million
dollars.  this value is now much smaller.

>    5.   If above=true, then Feds dropping the Zimmerman PGP case probably
>         also points to it also being crackable in a similar manner.

The Feds dropped the Zimmerman case because there wasn't any evidence to
support the accusation that PRZ had exported PGP or broken any laws.  Also,
if someone was ever tried for ITAR violations, it would most likely be found
unconstitutional.

>    6.   Using encryption only flags traffic for capture and decryption, 
>         using strong encryption makes you all that more interesting.

This is why there is steganography.

- -- Mark

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
markm@voicenet.com              | finger -l for PGP key 0xe3bf2169
http://www.voicenet.com/~markm/ | d61734f2800486ae6f79bfeb70f95348
((2b) || !(2b))                 | Old key now used only for signatures
"The concept of normalcy is just a conspiracy of the majority" -me


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"Mark M." writes:
> > Extrapolations of fact:
> >    1.   Internet traffic is monitored.
> 
> Maybe.  But I doubt that the above story is true.

>From what I can tell, the story is pure excrement.

Just to give everyone a reality check here, I routinely use encrypted
links across the net, often internationally. A houseguest of mine used
3DES from my apartment to his office in Finland for days. No one has
as much as sneezed at any of this. None of it is the least bit unusual
or illegal to begin with.

Perry