Re: VISA Travel Money

At 10:55 AM 7/30/96 -0700, Mike Duvos wrote:
>Happened to browse the VISA Web site last evening to read about
>the new microprocessor-based VISA Cash Cards that are being
>accepted in lieu of small change at the Olympics in Atlanta.
>
>While there, I noticed a new product that VISA is about to
>introduce.  Called "VISA Travel Money", it is a pre-paid card
>with a user-selected PIN which one can simply purchase at a
>participating financial institution, just like Travelers Checks.
>One can then use it at any of the 250,000 ATMs in 89 countries
>until the amount one paid for it has been extracted, after which,
>one presumedly tosses it.
>
>Since the card is pre-paid, and does not involve the extension of
>credit, I would think that a "nym" would have no difficulty in
>purchasing one.  Seems like a convenient way to keep moderate
>amounts of cash in a form which cannot be easily stolen, nor
>perused by the Feds.
>
>I wonder if an SSN is required at the time of purchase?


Even if not, chances are good that "all" of the transactions can be linked 
together, even if they can't be directly linked to an identifiable person.  
Doesn't sound too promising.

Jim Bell
jimbell@pacifier.com

Jim Bell writes:

> Even if not, chances are good that "all" of the transactions can 
> be linked together, even if they can't be directly linked to an 
> identifiable person.  Doesn't sound too promising.

I think it will be a popular product.  Sort of the credit card
equivalent of the disposable phone card.  

Since the transactions all involve the extraction of money, there
is really no record of your purchases.  The linking together of a 
number of cash wishdrawals is not that big a deal, although they
could be used to track your movements if you did them in more than
one specific location.

There is also the problem of being photographed every time you use
an ATM, if you do not wish your identity known. 

Still, for people who are not on the FBI's most wanted list, who
plan to completely exhaust the card in a single location, and who
dislike signing a huge bunch of Traveler's Checks at one time to 
buy something, it sounds like something that might be handy to have. 

--
     Mike Duvos         $    PGP 2.6 Public Key available     $
     mpd@netcom.com     $    via Finger.                      $

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                          SANDY SANDFORT
 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

C'punks,

On Tue, 30 Jul 1996, jim bell wrote:

> Even if not, chances are good that "all" of the transactions
> can be linked together, even if they can't be directly linked
> to an identifiable person.   Doesn't sound too promising.

It sounds VERY promising to me.  Though I'm sure Jim's conjecture
about linking transactions is correct, I don't see how such an
aonymous payment system could not be useful in preserving privacy.
One could purchase several of these cards--preferably in the 
smallest denominations consistent with their mission.  Each card
could be used so that its audit trail left whatever impression
one wished to leave.

Of course, if you are arrested with one or more of them on you,
they could be used to tie you to times, places and activities
with which you might not wish to be associated.  Proper handling
could obviate or reduce this risk however.

It's not as anonymous as cash, but it might draw a lot less
attention in my circumstances.  I think it has a place in one's
aresenal of privacy enchancing technologies.


 S a n d y

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On Tue, 30 Jul 1996, Sandy Sandfort wrote:
> It sounds VERY promising to me.  Though I'm sure Jim's conjecture
> about linking transactions is correct, I don't see how such an
> aonymous payment system could not be useful in preserving privacy.
> One could purchase several of these cards--preferably in the 
> smallest denominations consistent with their mission.  Each card
> could be used so that its audit trail left whatever impression
> one wished to leave.
> 
> Of course, if you are arrested with one or more of them on you,
> they could be used to tie you to times, places and activities
> with which you might not wish to be associated.  Proper handling
> could obviate or reduce this risk however.
> 
> It's not as anonymous as cash, but it might draw a lot less
> attention in my circumstances.  I think it has a place in one's
> aresenal of privacy enchancing technologies.

     This card has the value "written" when you "purchase" it right? 

    Any one wanna bet on how long it will take the "Hacker" Community
to figure out how to "refill" it? Otherwise all you have is a 
debit card. 

Petro, Christopher C.
petro@suba.com <prefered for any non-list stuff>
snow@smoke.suba.com

Snow writes:

> This card has the value "written" when you "purchase" it right? 

No.  Unlike the VISA Cash Card, which has a chip in it and holds
value, this card is simply associated with an account containing 
the money, which is accessed in the normal manner using ATMs and
VISA's PLUS network.  You can even have multiple cards issued on 
same account, if you choose to do so, and you get the standard set
of cardmember services, such as lost card replacement, that you
get with a regular credit card. 

> Any one wanna bet on how long it will take the "Hacker" Community
> to figure out how to "refill" it? Otherwise all you have is a 
> debit card. 

Which is precisely what this card is.  A disposable debit card 
sold through participating financial institutions. 

That isn't to say hackers might not have some fun with the 
system, but the card by itself is not vulnerable to such an
attack. 

--
     Mike Duvos         $    PGP 2.6 Public Key available     $
     mpd@netcom.com     $    via Finger.                      $