Re: VISA Travel Money

Timothy C. May wrote:

> I'm also skeptical of these "VISA Travel Money" cards. That is, they don't
> seem to be too useful for anything.

They are usefull for the one purpose for which they are designed. One
can go off to a foreign country and obtain cash as required without
having to pay often usurous fees from bureaux de change. Just because
you are supposed to be able to use travel cheques as cash does not mean
that you really can.

> After all, cash works well. (It's rarely stolen, in my experience, or at
> least this is not a major concern. Traveller's checks work well, and can be
> "cashed" into the local currency. ATM machines fill the same function these
> "VISA Travel Money" cards apparently do; at least when I was in Europe the
> last time this is what I used, and my French francs were as untraceable as
> could be.
>
> As I see it, yet another marketing solution looking for a problem.

Its not a major VISA product but it is reasonably usefull. Its more convenient
to carry a card than cash. If one gets mugged or looses the card there
is a way of recovering the cash (sometimes). I don't think that there would
be much use for such cards in the tourist belt but you might well want to
have one if you were going on a trip to the hinterlands of a country.

For most people VISA travel cheques or a cash advance is likely to be
more usefull. 
 
> A real step would be a true privacy card, a card issued in a jurisdiction
> unfriendly to U.S. investigators and offering various transaction-blinding
> options. I have to wonder what pressures have been put on the major credit
> card companies...

See the Stored Value Card work that VISA have been working on, or MONDEX.
MONDEX has almost every feature you would want from anonymous cash except 
you can't prove its anonymous. You can do purse to purse transfers 
however.

Its a different level of privacy to that of e-cash. e-cash provides
only purchaser unlinkability and its an online scheme. MONDEX makes
it possible to trace certain withdrawal and deposit patterns of a user
but little else. 


		Phill

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                          SANDY SANDFORT
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C'punks,

On Fri, 2 Aug 1996, Hallam-Baker wrote:

> They [VISA Travel Money cards] are usefull for the one purpose
> for which they are designed. One can go off to a foreign
> country and obtain cash...

Agreed, but does anyone have any reason to believe that these
cards cannot now (or perhaps will) be used just like regular
VISA cards for purchases in stores, restaurants, etc.?

I have two VISA debit cards in my name which can be used anywhere
VISA credit cards are accepted.  The VISA Travel Money card 
appears to be nothing more than a debit card that is tied to a
special sub-account at the issuing bank rather that the account
of a named individual.  At least where the retail establishment
has an on-line credit card terminal, the risks and protections
should be equivalent to a regular debit card. 

I'd bet dollars to donuts that the VISA Travel Money cards will
be usable just like VISA credit and debit cards within the next
2-3 years.  My guess is that they are just going slow to see
what sort of reception the Money cards get.


 S a n d y

P.S.	Phil should realize that my offer to bet dollars
	against donuts was not a serious wager.  It will
	not be necessary, therefore, for him to come up
	with some elaborate rationale to weasle out of
	the bet.  :-)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I don't think that VISA travel money will be a major product
for VISA. When I spoke with Azbo about it it was not a 
major strategic direction for them.  He described its use by 
First Bank of Internet (later first Branch of Internet).  I think that
VISA would LIKE to provide the Ability for travel money, to function 
as a debit card, but it would then be very close to their existing 
product of secured payment cards.There are good reasons why aproduct 
that allows you to draw a specific amount of cash out of ATM's is a good 
idea for VISA and useful for a small number of customers, but I think 
you're reading way to much into this.  Much more interesting are proposals
by the Federal reserve Board, to exempt from regulation E certain types of 
stored value card provided they store no more than $100.  While $500 would
seem to me to be a more serious and sensible level while still not having
particular money laundering advantage (5 $100 bills is smaller than 
one smart card) it is at least a start.

Phill

PS Be willing to bet donuts provided he can suggest a way of delivering them 
via internet.

Where does one buy these Visa debit cards. Great idea for travel in the
Philippines, where ATM's are widespread but Travellors checks are not very
negotiable.