faulty moderation software: duplicate messages

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    Virtually all list postings to the cypherpunks main list are 
    doubled; the first, which is a standard pass through with the 
    message ID of the sender, the second with the message ID of 
    toad.com.

    Obviously, the first is destined for the unedited list --which did 
    _not_ receive the message. The second has been re-IDd, which I 
    presume is your censorhip mark.

    I happen to subscribe to all three lists, even though
        
        main + flames == unedited

    is supposedly the intention, it is not. In order to divide the
    output stream from toad.com, sorting on "Sender: " is the only
    reasonable differentation (when toad's filters are working):

        Sender: owner-cypherpunks@toad.com
        Sender: owner-cypherpunks-flames@toad.com
        Sender: owner-cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com
        Sender: owner-coderpunks@toad.com

    in the case cited below, the only differentation between the 
    destinations is that the censored message has a "Message-ID: "
    from toad.com, while the one intended for unedited has a 
    "Message-ID: " not from toad.com.  was either of these 
    destinated from flames? --the main list with duplicated messages
    has contained any number of messages, including ones from the
    ASCII art series which should have gone to flames.

    so, why is the pass through message not being reliably re-headered 
    at toad.com to mark "Sender: owner-cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com"
    --but if it is, why is unedited receiving a duplicate --obviously
    the duplicate should have gone to flames. 

    BOTTOM LINE: your software is inadequate.  my neighbors' kids write 
    better filters than you have installed.


+Received: from toad.com (toad.com [140.174.2.1])
+	by primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA05103
+	for <attila@primenet.com>; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 04:24:48 -0700 (MST)
+Received: (from majordom@localhost) by toad.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id
+DAA20391; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 03:21:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from
+hermes.ex.ac.uk (hermes.ex.ac.uk [194.83.11.25]) by toad.com
+(8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA20386; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 03:21:20 -0800
+(PST) Received: from aba@p28-dove-gui.tch.virgin.net [194.168.60.88]
+by hermes via ESMTP (LAA22615); Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:21:06 GMT Received:
+(from aba@localhost) by server.test.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA00460;
+Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:15:30 GMT Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:15:30 GMT
+Message-Id: <199702071115.LAA00460@server.test.net>
+From: Adam Back <aba@dcs.ex.ac.uk>
+To: mark@infolawalert.com
+Cc: cypherpunks@toad.com, mclow@owl.csusm.edu
+In-reply-to: <199702052256.OAA06322@toad.com> (message from Mark
+    Voorhees on Wed, 05 Feb 97 17:05:51 -0400)
+Subject: Re: Deloitte-Touche?
+Sender: owner-cypherpunks@toad.com
+Precedence: bulk
+X-UIDL: 5456a9a45ccaf4617ae176a63b26efb4

+Received: from toad.com (toad.com [140.174.2.1])
+	by primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA26045;
+	Fri, 7 Feb 1997 09:00:01 -0700 (MST)
+Received: (from majordom@localhost) by toad.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id
+HAA24892; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 07:12:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id:
+   <199702071512.HAA24892@toad.com>
+Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:15:30 GMT
+From: Adam Back <aba@dcs.ex.ac.uk>
+To: mark@infolawalert.com
+Cc: cypherpunks@toad.com, mclow@owl.csusm.edu
+Subject: Re: Deloitte-Touche?
+Sender: owner-cypherpunks@toad.com
+Precedence: bulk
+X-UIDL: 83079c59aea2b28dc5ded2dc73c5219a


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All messages with "Sender: owner-cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com" are received
from the flames list.  The difference between the unedited and moderated lists
is that the moderated list changes the message ID, appending toad.com, and
deletes all received headers before "majordom@localhost.*by toad.com".  None
of the messages are being doubled; this is just the result of buggy software

Here's the recipe I use to filter out the three separate lists:

:0
* ^Sender: owner-cypherpunks.*@toad.com
{
	:0
	* ^Sender: owner-cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com
	flames

	:0
	* -1^1 ^Received:
	* 3^1  ^Received:.*from majordom@localhost.*by toad.com
	* ^Message-Id:.*toad.com
	in.cpunks

	:0
	unedited
}

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on or about 970207:1759 "Mark M." <markm@voicenet.com> said:

+All messages with "Sender: owner-cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com" are
+received from the flames list.  The difference between the unedited and
+moderated lists is that the moderated list changes the message ID,
+appending toad.com, and deletes all received headers before
+"majordom@localhost.*by toad.com".  None of the messages are being
+doubled; this is just the result of buggy software

    if you receive both the unedited and the censored plus flames, each 
    message should be doubled --unedited sends all messages, but fails 
    to always mark them in sender -basically, you need to key on the 
    fact the Message-ID is NOT ....@toad.com for the unedited file

    no, I dont have a problem with that, it is just stupid on toad's 
    part (John?) to not correctly identify the pass through messages 
    with 'Sender: owner-cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com'  --a few are, 
    but the vast majority are still shipped out as 'Sender: 
    owner-cypherpunks@toad.com' (and the 'Received' chain as I pointed 
    out in my original post). to me that is piss poor list management.

    unfortunately, I can not use procmail at this point on my mail 
    reader platform, but the internal filters are multilevel and do 
    allow enough flexibility. I use procmail extensively on my host for 
    autobots, spam filtering, objectional posters filtering, etc. 

    I think you  probably have an error in your procmail script as to 
    sending 'unedited' to flames. the theory stated is:
    
        mainline (censored) + flames == unedited

    but I will not test it since I prefer to read/respond off line with 
    MR/2 than Pine online. I will request Nick Knight for the 
    construction of his folders (except he has no lock mechanism) and I 
    might write a PPP POP3 mail recovery program, pass it through 
    procmail which passes it to a function to write it to MR/2's 
    folders.

        however you slice it, censorship on a freedom of speech list     
    just does not make it and we make fools of ourselves if we think 
    otherwise.

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