Re: Impact of Netscape kernel hole

Dave Smith wrote:

>I still have a copy of MCOM/Netscape Navigator 0.94 around... does the
>bug exist this far back, or am I going to have to start using Cello,
>or something equally obscure?

Dave suggests the key to Netscape's Andreesen's amazing trajectory 
from lab rat gizmoid to market leader, while others languish uncompensated,
at least just yet. 

It's Mark's changeable feature for peeking and tracking, approved by law for 
orderly commerce. "Bugs bounty" is the make light of it charade, while
"bug" is the venerable hardware name.

Find the first few, sure, that's for easy diversion, find those somewhat
deeper, those're for sweeping by the seasoned pros. Then there are those 
that are never found, the ones that always tell what's needed to know in 
national emergency but can never be revealed.

Perhaps any day now MS and NSCP will morph to push browser GAK, 
claiming that public privacy and secure commerce demand protection from 
cyber-terrorists. 

That's the theme, hey, hey, of the Denver meet of global leaders on 
June 20. Could it be that that's what the Silicon chiefs went to DC to plan 
last week while speechifying contrarily to CNN, C-SPAN and Declan.

Surely, though, bountifully trusty PGP is not party to this G-10 globalization 
of crippled crypto, or at least not its Chief Technology Officer, right?

BTW, Declan's spin on national affairs is starting to smell of pontification
to the
masses, classis sign of "if only you knew what I've been let in on."
Shimomuraism,
that, empty data.

On Sun, 15 Jun 1997, John Young wrote:

> That's the theme, hey, hey, of the Denver meet of global leaders on 
> June 20. Could it be that that's what the Silicon chiefs went to DC to plan 
> last week while speechifying contrarily to CNN, C-SPAN and Declan.
> 
> Surely, though, bountifully trusty PGP is not party to this G-10 globalization 
> of crippled crypto, or at least not its Chief Technology Officer, right?
> 
> BTW, Declan's spin on national affairs is starting to smell of pontification
> to the
> masses, classis sign of "if only you knew what I've been let in on."
> Shimomuraism,
> that, empty data.

Really? Can you point to examples? I certainly don't mean to be.

Though I do learn a lot of things I can't write about directly. I had
dinner last week with a senior White House official and an FTC
commissioner and a bunch of other folks. The condition of the invite was
not reporting on what was discussed. Yesterday I spent the afternoon with
folks including a Supreme Court clerk and a Federal judge. Friday evening
I went to a party with a bunch of Republican heavyweights where we talked
about what the Senate leadership is doing with the crypto bills.

If I come across as arrogant or stand-offish, call me on it. But, geez, I
cover this stuff full-time and then some. Sometimes I *do* know stuff that
isn't public. If it's interesting enough, I pursue it, verify it with
folks who can talk on the record, and then write about it.

-Declan

At 4:09 PM -0700 6/15/97, Tim May wrote:
>One way they buy people--very reminiscent of the methods used to recruit
>spies--is to feed reporters with information they can't get anywhere else,
>and swear them to secrecy. This ties them up in complicated webs of trust,
>mistrust, and deceit, and makes the reporters more dependent on them for
>future stories.

All reporters should carefully consider the example of I. F. Stone.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Frantz       | The Internet was designed  | Periwinkle -- Consulting
(408)356-8506     | to protect the free world  | 16345 Englewood Ave.
frantz@netcom.com | from hostile governments.  | Los Gatos, CA 95032, USA

At 2:36 PM -0700 6/15/97, Declan McCullagh wrote:

>Though I do learn a lot of things I can't write about directly. I had
>dinner last week with a senior White House official and an FTC
>commissioner and a bunch of other folks. The condition of the invite was
>not reporting on what was discussed. Yesterday I spent the afternoon with
>folks including a Supreme Court clerk and a Federal judge. Friday evening
>I went to a party with a bunch of Republican heavyweights where we talked
>about what the Senate leadership is doing with the crypto bills.
>

Maybe what John was saying is that you're being co-opted. Brought into the
inner circles, shown the secrets, wined and dined (and whined)...maybe
you'll even be invited to Fort Meade for a screening of the "If you only
knew what we knew" video.

When you have dinner with judges, cops, senators, narcs, and other such
insiders, and much of it is "deep background" (or whatever such briefings
are called), and you have to promise to only spin the story in certain
ways...well, the result is pretty obviously that you're just an outlet for
the agitprop machine.

I'm not saying you've sold out yet; I don't really know you, so I wouldn't
know how vulnerable you are. But you're sure showing all the signs of
becoming just another Washington Insider.

One way they buy people--very reminiscent of the methods used to recruit
spies--is to feed reporters with information they can't get anywhere else,
and swear them to secrecy. This ties them up in complicated webs of trust,
mistrust, and deceit, and makes the reporters more dependent on them for
future stories.

--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

Tim is right to raise these points. In fact I've talked about "DC
insiderism" with him and here on the list in the past.

But Tim's conclusions are way off-target. Just because you have access to
information doesn't mean you've been co-opted. For instance, contrary to
what Tim says, I've never "promised to spin the story in a certain way."
That's the job of a PR flack, not a journalist. Also, contrary to what Tim
says, I've never been "sworn to secrecy." Rather, some discussions are
off-the-record, which is fairly common practice even if you're covering
City Hall in Topeka. Doesn't mean I can't use the information -- as I said
in the paragraph Tim elided, I do -- just that I can't quote a particular
person.

Tim writes: But you're sure showing all the signs of becoming just another
Washington Insider."

In truth I'm doing what a reporter should do: talk to lots of folks who
are involved in a particular issue. If this makes me an "insider," I'll
cop to that. But if I didn't meet and chat with thse folks, I wouldn't be
doing my job.

I mean, geez, if nothing else, look at what I've been writing. Last
Thursday I wrote about how the Federal government should get out of the
business of "protecting privacy." On Friday I wrote about how "protecting
children" from animated cartoon images is another pretext for
Net-censorship. Who else is saying that?

If anything, I've becoming more cynical as I spend more time on this beat.

-Declan

Declan McCullagh <declan@pathfinder.com> writes:

> But Tim's conclusions are way off-target. Just because you have access to
> information doesn't mean you've been co-opted. For instance, contrary to
> what Tim says, I've never "promised to spin the story in a certain way."

You don't have to promise.  You're very predictable.  Given certain
inputs you're very likely to write certain outputs.

> I mean, geez, if nothing else, look at what I've been writing. Last
> Thursday I wrote about how the Federal government should get out of the
> business of "protecting privacy." On Friday I wrote about how "protecting
> children" from animated cartoon images is another pretext for
> Net-censorship. Who else is saying that?

Can a mailing list poster silence others by talking too much?

---

Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM
Brighton Beach Boardwalk BBS, Forest Hills, N.Y.: +1-718-261-2013, 14.4Kbps

> I mean, geez, if nothing else, look at what I've been writing. Last
> Thursday I wrote about how the Federal government should get out of the
> business of "protecting privacy." On Friday I wrote about how "protecting
> children" from animated cartoon images is another pretext for
> Net-censorship. Who else is saying that?

I must side with Declan here, true, sometimes Declans articles show a 
subtle hint of insiderism <tm>, but I believe that is an inevitable 
consequence of working around people in D.C. who don`t want to be 
directly associated with certain statements, to quote them against their 
will would be journalistic suicide and would soon see Declan with no 
contacts whatsoever. 

Also, although his articles are often written to be readable by the 
uninformed rather than security experts or cryptographers they often 
raise important points. Remember, although through Declan and John Young 
we have a lot of current news posts coming on to the list the average AOL 
account owning newbie won`t know about these things and reading some of 
Declans articles might just get them thinking.

        Datacomms Technologies data security
       Paul Bradley, Paul@fatmans.demon.co.uk
  Paul@crypto.uk.eu.org, Paul@cryptography.uk.eu.org    
       Http://www.cryptography.home.ml.org/
      Email for PGP public key, ID: FC76DA85
     "Don`t forget to mount a scratch monkey"

At 10:10 -0700 6/16/97, Tim May wrote:
>Some of you, including Declan, have read too much in my comments. I did not
>say he _had_ sold out, I said in several places there is a well-known
>danger of becoming assimilated by the Washington system. Reread what I said.
>
>(By the way, I've never suggested Declan would lose his ideological
>bearings. Democrats and Republicans who become assimilated remain true to
>their roots, but they see everything as part of a larger system, a
>negotiation. They lose their ability to see in outside the Beltway simple
>terms. The giveaway will be if and when Declan begins to say that things
>are not so simple.)

What I found interesting about Tim's comments above is how he neglects to
mention libertarians. Certainly he realizes my "ideological bearings" are
much closer to libertarianism than conservatism or modern liberalism.

Do the folks at the Cato Institute, the Competitive Enterprise Institute,
IFJ, IHS, or AEI "lose their ability to see in simple terms?" I suggest not.

-Declan

PS: Details about negotiations and who's-backing-what-bill and what the
political tradeoffs will be are often astoundingly complex. But the
underlying principles remain crystal-clear: government out of our private
lives.

At 12:41 -0700 6/16/97, Tim May wrote:
>As to why I "elide" paragraphs, I do it as I always do it, to save space
>and to adhere to the "never quote more than a half page of text" rule of
>thumb.

Fair enough. I was being overly sensitive.

-Declan



-------------------------
Declan McCullagh
Time Inc.
The Netly News Network
Washington Correspondent
http://netlynews.com/

At 10:10 AM 6/16/97 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>I wish Declan well, really. But his frequent name-dropping about soirees
>he's been invited to, bigwigs he's had power lunches with...well, I think
>the evolution has been set in motion. 

Foo ...  On a list with several millionares, people who make the 
New York Times Magazine cover, people who get in the Times for
successfully suing the NSA, college students who get covered on
National Public Radio, people who were in Wired before it was c001,
people who drop in on Esther in New York because they'll be too 
busy to see her at Hackers', people who were Xanadudes or SGML hackers
decades before the Web caught on, people who were on the Well
before that Grateful Dead lyricist got there, various wizards of
speed and time, folks who have Japanese tv crews show up for their parties
and already know Tim Leary when he drops... by, I'd say we have enough
people who are or know Silicon Valley insiders to really complain much
when people from the Other Coast talk about who _they_ had lunch with :-)


#			Thanks;  Bill
# Bill Stewart, +1-415-442-2215 stewarts@ix.netcom.com
# You can get PGP outside the US at ftp.ox.ac.uk/pub/crypto/pgp
#   (If this is a mailing list or news, please Cc: me on replies.  Thanks.)

At 2:43 pm -0400 on 6/17/97, Tim May wrote:


> I had two more parties to get to that night, so I bid the boys a good night
> and got back in my beat up car and headed off to Dupont Circle. I heard
> that Sally the Schemer, doyenne of the Washington social circle, had some
> juicy news on how Dotty the Crypto Chick was being placed in the Witness
> Security Program.
:-)


Don't quit your day job, Tim.

Cheers,
Hunter S. Hettinga


-----------------
Robert Hettinga (rah@shipwright.com), Philodox
e$, 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
The e$ Home Page: http://www.shipwright.com/

At 9:59 pm -0400 on 6/18/97, Steve Schear wrote:


> "Atoms to Bits: The Future of Money," in the June/July edition of Markets
> magazine (page 17), appears to have an unattributed quote from our very own
> Bob Hettinga:

Yeah. the guy who wrote it said that he did attribute it to me, but since I
was "someone the average Telerate user wouldn't recognise", the copy
editors killed it.

Maybe I should write a letter to the editor or something, but I seem to be
aspiring to lethargy on the issue at the moment...

Cheers,
Bob Hettinga

-----------------
Robert Hettinga (rah@shipwright.com), Philodox
e$, 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
The e$ Home Page: http://www.shipwright.com/

At 4:26 AM -0700 6/16/97, Paul Bradley wrote:
>> I mean, geez, if nothing else, look at what I've been writing. Last
>> Thursday I wrote about how the Federal government should get out of the
>> business of "protecting privacy." On Friday I wrote about how "protecting
>> children" from animated cartoon images is another pretext for
>> Net-censorship. Who else is saying that?
>
>I must side with Declan here, true, sometimes Declans articles show a
>subtle hint of insiderism <tm>, but I believe that is an inevitable
>consequence of working around people in D.C. who don`t want to be
>directly associated with certain statements, to quote them against their
>will would be journalistic suicide and would soon see Declan with no
>contacts whatsoever.

Some of you, including Declan, have read too much in my comments. I did not
say he _had_ sold out, I said in several places there is a well-known
danger of becoming assimilated by the Washington system. Reread what I said.

(By the way, I've never suggested Declan would lose his ideological
bearings. Democrats and Republicans who become assimilated remain true to
their roots, but they see everything as part of a larger system, a
negotiation. They lose their ability to see in outside the Beltway simple
terms. The giveaway will be if and when Declan begins to say that things
are not so simple.)

>Also, although his articles are often written to be readable by the
>uninformed rather than security experts or cryptographers they often
>raise important points. Remember, although through Declan and John Young
>we have a lot of current news posts coming on to the list the average AOL
>account owning newbie won`t know about these things and reading some of
>Declans articles might just get them thinking.

Without intending to criticize Declan, I see nothing especially new or
insightful in his pieces. Stuff we've covered many times. The main
attention given to his articles comes from, I strongly suspect, our
projection that the sheeple are reading and being persuaded by his articles.

But, all part of the traditional "journalist as celebrity" path. No, this
is not jealousy speaking....I'm rather satisfied with my rate of pay over
the years compared to what I might have earned in journalism! And if I
really wanted to speak to the masses, I'd be more diligent in pursuing book
deals.

I wish Declan well, really. But his frequent name-dropping about soirees
he's been invited to, bigwigs he's had power lunches with...well, I think
the evolution has been set in motion. "Things are not as simple as
libertarians would have us believe."?

--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

At 12:01 PM -0700 6/16/97, Declan McCullagh wrote:

>What I found interesting about Tim's comments above is how he neglects to
>mention libertarians. Certainly he realizes my "ideological bearings" are
>much closer to libertarianism than conservatism or modern liberalism.

Now this is _really_ reading too much into things. As with several of your
"in the paragraphs Tim chose to elide" sorts of comments, you are imputing
motives that aren't there.

I mentioned Republicans and Democrats--and not Black Panthers,
Libertarians, Maoists, and Galambosians, for example--becuase these two
factions account for 99% of those in D.C., reporters included.

As to why I "elide" paragraphs, I do it as I always do it, to save space
and to adhere to the "never quote more than a half page of text" rule of
thumb.

(Something I wish more writers would do. When I see a screenful of quoted
material, I'll usually at least scroll down to the next page: if more stuff
is quoted, I'm often likely to just hit the "D" key.)

I never set out to elide material so as to misrepresent people. Granted,
there are some who think their point is automatically subtracted from if
every golden word is not quoted, but, like I said, I try to begin my
response to a post before a screenfull has been quoted, with the quoted
material only serving as a reminder to the reader of what the other person
had already said.


--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

At 2:30 am -0400 on 6/17/97, Bill Stewart wrote:

> Foo ...  On a list with several millionares, people who make the
> New York Times Magazine cover, people who get in the Times for
> successfully suing the NSA, college students who get covered on
> National Public Radio, people who were in Wired before it was c001,
> people who drop in on Esther in New York because they'll be too
> busy to see her at Hackers', people who were Xanadudes or SGML hackers
> decades before the Web caught on, people who were on the Well
> before that Grateful Dead lyricist got there, various wizards of
> speed and time, folks who have Japanese tv crews show up for their parties
> and already know Tim Leary when he drops... by, I'd say we have enough
> people who are or know Silicon Valley insiders to really complain much
> when people from the Other Coast talk about who _they_ had lunch with :-)

Wow. How utterly cool. I guess it's time to move. Your country sounds waay
better than my country...

;-)

Cheers,
Bob Hettinga

-----------------
Robert Hettinga (rah@shipwright.com), Philodox
e$, 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
The e$ Home Page: http://www.shipwright.com/

At 11:30 PM -0700 6/16/97, Bill Stewart wrote:

>Foo ...  On a list with several millionares, people who make the
>New York Times Magazine cover, people who get in the Times for
>successfully suing the NSA, college students who get covered on
>National Public Radio, people who were in Wired before it was c001,
>people who drop in on Esther in New York because they'll be too
>busy to see her at Hackers', people who were Xanadudes or SGML hackers
>decades before the Web caught on, people who were on the Well
>before that Grateful Dead lyricist got there, various wizards of
>speed and time, folks who have Japanese tv crews show up for their parties
>and already know Tim Leary when he drops... by, I'd say we have enough
>people who are or know Silicon Valley insiders to really complain much
>when people from the Other Coast talk about who _they_ had lunch with :-)

I asked Marc what he thought of this, and he suggested we wander over and
ask Ted. Ted said it had to do with everything being deeply intertwingled.
The other Ted, the microprocessor guy, just wanted to get back to
woodworking.

Later on I ran into Whit and he said he hadn't given it much thought, but
that maybe Larry had.

I resolved to ask Gordon how he dealt with this situation, but I may not
run into him for awhile.

Next Saturday I'll ask Woz, assuming he show's up at Alan's party as he
usually does.

What was your point again?

(On a serious note, I take Bill's point. But I am not criticizing Declan's
growing list of contacts, I am really commenting on the "gossipy" aspect of
all D.C. politics. "There's no there, there," to paraphrase the Other
Dorothy (and not the Oz one). In D.C., the whole political process is a
series of social contacts. This is markedly different from life here in the
Greater Bay Area (100 miles north-south, 20 miles east-west), where the
technology and products dominate over gossip. Or so I think. Reporters in
the Bay Area are much less dependent on spin doctors for their stories.)

--Tim May



There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

Dear Citizen-Unit May;

It is not easy working in the Washington area. All of us have to devote a 
significant amount of time to inventing newsworthy activies to keep the 
media well-fed and all of you west-coast slackers entertained. We would 
appreciate it if you showed more respect for our efforts. While you're at 
it, try to pay a bit more in taxes; things are getting to be almost as 
expensive over here as they are out in the valley. I was knocking back a 
brew with Bill the other day, and it cost me five bucks.

-SpinMarsupial

On Tue, 17 Jun 1997, Tim May wrote:

> Dorothy (and not the Oz one). In D.C., the whole political process is a
> series of social contacts. This is markedly different from life here in the

Another way of viewing the Washington reporter problem is to view him as a
Hollywood reporter, sort of an Army Archerd character "doing lunch" at
Chasen's and The Brown Derby, not to mention doing lines at the Viper Club.

But a more accurate comparison is to crime beat reporters, those scribblers
who hang out at the Mafia watering holes and social clubs (when they're
allowed in, to spin a story in a favorable way), reporting on the turf
battles between the rival factions, and leaking out rumors of who's
planning to make a move on Vinnie Bones.

Washington is more than just a "pork barrel"...it's the world's largest and
most lavishly funded criminal enterprise, with "dons" dispensing pork to
supplicants, with new agencies intervening in private and corporate
transactions to throw roadblocks up, the better to extract tribute.

One can imagine Declan's story:

So I was like nervous as I met Donny the Arm, consigliero for the Kennedy
Family, at a dark little Irish pub in Georgetown. I could see he'd brought
some SS muscle with him, waiting out in his beamer. Nervous because I knew
what the Don's men had done to that reporter covering the Mary Jo Kopechne
accident.

So I got right to the point.

"I hear Billy the Chin is prepared to give some "consideration" to Jimmy
out in the Valley if he gets some consideration in return, something like a
5 big ones contribution to the Midnight Video Arcade program?," I asked.

"Ya heard right. Nobody said like we're no reasonable, or sumpin.' Say,
what's a good mick like you doin' talking to that wop D'Amato?," the aide
to Don Eddie said. I pressed him to return to the point about allowing
Netscape to export full-strength crypto if they make a contribution to the
President's favorite inner city program.

"Well," Donny the Arm said, "It's like this: before we tell the guys over
in Export to let his stuff out, we would, like, want some consideration." I
was puzzled, so I asked him what kind of consideration he was tallking
about.

"You wearin' a wire or sumpin'? Yo, you fall out of a tree, or sumpin'?"

My next visit that night was to a posh hunting lodge out in horse country,
home of most of the dons in the Reps Gang. Their leader, Newt the Shooter
laid it out in his own straight-shooting style.

"We're prepared to deal. If Billie the Chin signs off on the tax cuts to
our industries, and if the tobacco subsidy is restored, we're prepared to
support the Family's plan to repeal the First Amendment. It  hardly fits
with family values, anyway."

I had two more parties to get to that night, so I bid the boys a good night
and got back in my beat up car and headed off to Dupont Circle. I heard
that Sally the Schemer, doyenne of the Washington social circle, had some
juicy news on how Dotty the Crypto Chick was being placed in the Witness
Security Program.


One more day in the life of Declan McCullagh, Washington Crime Family Reporter

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

At 20:34 -0700 6/17/97, Vladimir Z. Nuri wrote:
>hee, hee, I hope that Declan comes up with an amusing mishmash of your
>own life. turnabout is fair play. maybe if he doesn't, someone else
>can take a stab at satirizing mr. debauched millionaire playboy
>who dabbles in cryptography theory.

I was far from offended by Tim's post; in fact, I thought it was hilarious.

But perhaps I will come up with a "Day in the Life of Tim 'Lock and Load'
May, renegade cypherpunk, millionaire playboy, and curmudgeonly
crypto-anarchist." Anyone want to join me in writing it?

-Declan

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 01:50 PM 6/18/97 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>Washington is literally nothing more than just the
>world's largest shakedown racket, with taxpayers being extorted amounts of
>money probably unprecedented in world history (*), with various factions
>dispensing favors to some and punishing others.

Each year, the U.S. federal government steals and spends more money (and more 
actual value) than any government has ever stolen and blown before in the 
history of mankind.   It has been the record holder for more than 50 years 
and each year it breaks its own record.

I am aware that this is because the U.S. is the world's largest economy but 
that fact does not diminish the scale of the theft.

DCF

"And still they want more."
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=stVA
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"Atoms to Bits: The Future of Money," in the June/July edition of Markets
magazine (page 17), appears to have an unattributed quote from our very own
Bob Hettinga:

	Take, for example, this comment from a futurist's correspondence
	on the Internet: "I expect that this new cashsettled, information-
	based, geodesic economy we're heading into will have some group which
	will figure out how to confiscate economic rents from the productive
	elements of society, much in the way that aristocrats did to
agriculture
	or nation-states did to industry."

--Steve


PGP mail preferred
Fingerprint: FE 90 1A 95 9D EA 8D 61  81 2E CC A9 A4 4A FB A9
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        I know not what instruments others may use,
        but as for me, give me Ecache or give me debt.

        SHOW ME THE DIGITS!

At 7:20 PM -0700 6/18/97, Robert Hettinga wrote:
>At 9:59 pm -0400 on 6/18/97, Steve Schear wrote:
>
>
>> "Atoms to Bits: The Future of Money," in the June/July edition of Markets
>> magazine (page 17), appears to have an unattributed quote from our very own
>> Bob Hettinga:
>
>Yeah. the guy who wrote it said that he did attribute it to me, but since I
>was "someone the average Telerate user wouldn't recognise", the copy
>editors killed it.

After this happened to me a while back, I told a later reporter that I
expected any quotes from me would be credited, as they were my words. I
told him I was not releasing my rights to these words, and that I wanted a
written, faxed, or e-mailed contract to this effect.

He said  he had no control over how his editors altered quotes, reworded
them, or deleted credits, so we ended our discussion at this point.

(No, this was not Declan.)

Not that it matters. Face it, our words in print vanish without a trace,
and are remembered by nobody except ourselves.

--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

[declan]
>Another way of viewing the Washington reporter problem is to view him as a
>Hollywood reporter, sort of an Army Archerd character "doing lunch" at
>Chasen's and The Brown Derby, not to mention doing lines at the Viper Club.
>
>But a more accurate comparison is to crime beat reporters, those scribblers
>who hang out at the Mafia watering holes and social clubs (when they're
>allowed in, to spin a story in a favorable way), reporting on the turf
>battles between the rival factions, and leaking out rumors of who's
>planning to make a move on Vinnie Bones.

ah, so lets see, given your strange fascination with the mafia and
mafia-like ventures such as Blacknet and anonymous digital-cash
funded cyberspace assassination, that would make you a prime
Declan follower and admirer.

>One more day in the life of Declan McCullagh, Washington Crime Family Reporter

hee, hee, I hope that Declan comes up with an amusing mishmash of your
own life. turnabout is fair play. maybe if he doesn't, someone else
can take a stab at satirizing mr. debauched millionaire playboy
who dabbles in cryptography theory.

At 11:37 AM -0700 6/18/97, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>At 20:34 -0700 6/17/97, Vladimir Z. Nuri wrote:
>>hee, hee, I hope that Declan comes up with an amusing mishmash of your
>>own life. turnabout is fair play. maybe if he doesn't, someone else
>>can take a stab at satirizing mr. debauched millionaire playboy
>>who dabbles in cryptography theory.
>
>I was far from offended by Tim's post; in fact, I thought it was hilarious.

And I took pains to make sure it was not taken as a malicious attack. It
was, if anything, a reflection of my realization (known before, but not in
this version) that Washington is literally nothing more than just the
world's largest shakedown racket, with taxpayers being extorted amounts of
money probably unprecedented in world history (*), with various factions
dispensing favors to some and punishing others.

Bruce Sterling, at CFP '97, had an awe-inspiring rant about this essential
criminality of governments around the world, how they use their powers to
shake down businessmen and citizens, how they are complicit in the drug
trade, how, of course, the drug trade wouldn't even exist in its current
criminal form if governments did not collude to criminalize drugs and then
run drugs in to their customers in the CIA's C-5 cargo planes. Sterling
discussed the "government as biggest crime syndicate" situtations in
several major countries, including Mexico, where the "Institutionalized
Revolutionary Party" (I'm not making that up, a la Orwell) kills its
opponents and runs the drug economy, Russia ('nuff said), Turkey (right
wing Pope killers, CIA station chiefs, and drug lords riding in the same
crashed car), and, last but not least, the United States of America.

(I hope a transcript is somewhere available on the Web, but his delivery
was done to perfection, so I hope a video of it is someday realeased.
Airing his 10-minute (I think) speech would be vastly more helpful to the
anti-fascist cause than all the meaningless "I take the Pledge" PR stuff.)


>But perhaps I will come up with a "Day in the Life of Tim 'Lock and Load'
>May, renegade cypherpunk, millionaire playboy, and curmudgeonly
>crypto-anarchist." Anyone want to join me in writing it?

No skin off my nose. Some good satire would be refreshing. Whomever was
doing the "Cypherpunks Enquirer" has apparently moved on to other things.
Neither Vulis' robograms nor Detweiler's foamings are very interesting.

--Tim May


There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."