CNN - Encryption bill expected to pass House - June 23, 1997

http://www.cnn.com/TECH/9706/23/encryption.reut/index.html

Encryption bill expected to pass House

June 23, 1997
Web posted at: 10:05 p.m. EDT (0205 GMT) 

WASHINGTON (Reuter) -- Legislation to
relax U.S. export limits on computer-encoding
technology is likely to move ahead in the
House of Representatives this week, despite
a severe setback in the Senate last week. 

The House International Relations' economic
policy and trade subcommittee will vote on a
bill Tuesday, chairwoman Ileana
Ros-Lehtinen, Republican of Florida, said. 

Current U.S. law strictly limits export of encryption software, which
scrambles
information and renders it unreadable without a password or software
"key." 

Once the realm of spies and generals, encryption has become a critical
technology to safeguard electronic commerce and global communications
over
the Internet. 

In the Senate last week, a similar bill to relax encryption-export
controls was
torpedoed when the Senate Commerce Committee approved a substitute which
would only modestly ease export restrictions. It effectively would allow
the
government to crack encrypted messages in the United States by gaining
access
to the software keys. 

The Clinton administration has been a strong proponent of so-called
key-recovery mechanisms, arguing that the proliferation of strong
encryption
without key recovery would hamper law-enforcement and national security
agencies' ability to keep tabs on criminals and terrorists. 

The House bill under consideration relaxes export rules without
requiring key
recovery. 

With 125 co-sponsors in the House, and "enthusiastic support" from
industry
and civil liberties and privacy advocates, the bill "is expected to be
passed with
limited changes," Ros-Lehtinen added. 

The bill could face a tougher challenge when considered by the full
International
Relations Committee. Chairman Benjamin Gilman, Republican of New York,
is
not a strong supporter of export liberalization, congressional staffers
said. 

U.S. software companies such as Netscape Communications, and Microsoft
Corp. have been clamoring for relief from encryption export controls. 

Copyright 1997 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved.

Yeah, I'm going to the markup later this afternoon. I ran into Goodlatte in
the Capitol this morning; he seemed cautiously optimistic.

-Declan

*********

At 10:28 -0700 6/24/97, Alan Olsen wrote:
>http://www.cnn.com/TECH/9706/23/encryption.reut/index.html
>
>Encryption bill expected to pass House
>
>June 23, 1997
>Web posted at: 10:05 p.m. EDT (0205 GMT)
>
>WASHINGTON (Reuter) -- Legislation to
>relax U.S. export limits on computer-encoding
>technology is likely to move ahead in the
>House of Representatives this week, despite
>a severe setback in the Senate last week.
>
>The House International Relations' economic
>policy and trade subcommittee will vote on a
>bill Tuesday, chairwoman Ileana
>Ros-Lehtinen, Republican of Florida, said.

At 11:43 AM -0700 6/24/97, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>Yeah, I'm going to the markup later this afternoon. I ran into Goodlatte in
>the Capitol this morning; he seemed cautiously optimistic.
>

The terrible, terrible S.909 McCain-Kerrey bill is probably a negotiating
card in the coming Grand Compromise.

When even editorial writers for the Establishment Papers are against it,
when industry is against it so vocally, it won't pass the full Congress.

But it will have served its purpose.

It will make many groups _satisfied_ to reach "a compromise we can all live
with." The various cyber-rights [sic] groups will probably trumpet this as
a victory, as "the best we could get."

Somewhere between SAFE, a bad bill, and McCain-Kerrey, a reprehensible
bill, lies the Grand Compromise.

I reject it all.


--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

Tim May writes:
> 
> The terrible, terrible S.909 McCain-Kerrey bill is probably a negotiating
> card in the coming Grand Compromise.

Yes.  The tactic will be to use S.909 in negotiation to represent a 'fair' 
government-oriented solution.   Then 'compromise' with a 'balanced'
deal which includes all that the government really wants, with a few
of the more onerous bits taken out of S.909 as 'compromise'.

As Declan notes, Congress is driven to compromise.  The
government side can propose ever more draconian laws in order to
engineer the 'compromise' to whatever it wants.  On the other side, we
are stuck, because we have been asking for things that we really want, not
bargaining chips.  Even if we were to ask for bargaining chips that
are more than we really want, how much further than completely free
crypto can you go?    The government wins any game of compromise because
it can push its side as far as it wants, then demand that we meet halfway.


> It will make many groups _satisfied_ to reach "a compromise we can all live
> with." The various cyber-rights [sic] groups will probably trumpet this as
> a victory, as "the best we could get."

They will make it out as a victory ("send us more money") but in
reality it'll just be a little less of a defeat.


The rejectionist stance has the presumption that, if unwatched, the
government will pass a law so onerous that the people will rise up
in protest.  Unfortunately I don't think Americans will rise up in
protest over _anything_ any more.  Certainly not over basic freedoms.



-- 
                   Eric Murray  ericm@lne.com 
  Network security and encryption consulting.    PGP keyid:E03F65E5

Eric Murray <ericm@lne.com> writes:
> Tim May writes:
> > 
> > The terrible, terrible S.909 McCain-Kerrey bill is probably a negotiating
> > card in the coming Grand Compromise.
> 
> As Declan notes, Congress is driven to compromise.  The
> government side can propose ever more draconian laws in order to
> engineer the 'compromise' to whatever it wants.  On the other side, we
> are stuck, because we have been asking for things that we really want, not
> bargaining chips.  Even if we were to ask for bargaining chips that
> are more than we really want, how much further than completely free
> crypto can you go?    

Oh I dunno.  We could get Tim to give a congressional statement,
highlighting the interesting consequences of a fully developed crypto
anarchic society.  That'd put the fear into them.  ('Course the
problem is we'd never get him to go within 100 miles of the place, and
he'd probably consider it a waste of time talking to them anyway.)

But there's scope I think.

But would it help?  Don't know.  It gets close to some aspects of the
NSA scare stories, money launderers, tax evasion, etc. etc.

Adam
-- 
Have *you* exported RSA today? --> http://www.dcs.ex.ac.uk/~aba/rsa/

print pack"C*",split/\D+/,`echo "16iII*o\U@{$/=$z;[(pop,pop,unpack"H*",<>
)]}\EsMsKsN0[lN*1lK[d2%Sa2/d0<X+d*lMLa^*lN%0]dsXx++lMlN/dsM0<J]dsJxp"|dc`

At 4:13 PM -0700 6/24/97, Adam Back wrote:
>Eric Murray <ericm@lne.com> writes:

>> As Declan notes, Congress is driven to compromise.  The
>> government side can propose ever more draconian laws in order to
>> engineer the 'compromise' to whatever it wants.  On the other side, we
>> are stuck, because we have been asking for things that we really want, not
>> bargaining chips.  Even if we were to ask for bargaining chips that
>> are more than we really want, how much further than completely free
>> crypto can you go?
>
>Oh I dunno.  We could get Tim to give a congressional statement,
>highlighting the interesting consequences of a fully developed crypto
>anarchic society.  That'd put the fear into them.  ('Course the
>problem is we'd never get him to go within 100 miles of the place, and
>he'd probably consider it a waste of time talking to them anyway.)

Actually, I was born in Bethesda, just north or northeast of The Once and
Future Swamp, lived in Maryland and Virginia for half my childhood, and
attended Fairfax County High Schools (Langley, across the woods from the
CIA, of course, and Edison). I've even back back several times, for
conferences and visits; I even drove out to see the NSA in 1991, to help
focus my energies.

(Note: "focus my energies" should not be taken as a euphemism for shaping
my charges.)

But I don't get the point of what would be gained by my testimony. It
wouldn't  help the Cause.

And, as many of us have noted, what is there to compromise about? If one
has religious freedom, for example, and a series of laws are proposed or
passed to limit this religious freedom in some way, what kind of compromise
is even remotely acceptable?

(By the way, I have no heard no good counters to my point that the "use of
crypto in furtherance of a crime" is quite analogous to "freedom of
religion shall not be abridged, but saying a heathen prayer in furtherance
of a crime shall subject the heathen to an additional five years of
imprisonment." This is why I think the "use of a special language or
whispering in furtherance of a crime" provisions of SAFE will probably be
struck down by the Supremes, unless they, too, have forgotten what the
Constitution is all about.)

The First Amendment is all we need to speak in the language of our
choosing, including the languages of whispers, Talegu, Navajo, pig latin,
coded signals, and 4000-bit RSA.

We don't need any "reaffirmations" of this basic right, at least not from
Congress.

--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

Tim May <tcmay@got.net> writes:
> But I don't get the point of what would be gained by my testimony. It
> wouldn't  help the Cause.

Reasoning was following on from Eric Murrays:

: how much further than completely free crypto can you go?

Most of the lobbyists as far as I can make out are talking in terms of
privacy from government, right to free speech.

Not in terms of eroding government power, avoiding taxes, making 
governments obsolete, nor in terms of hostility towards the legitimacy 
of government, it's methods etc.

So you might argue that this would make the privacy lobyists seem more
middle of the road.  However crypto is binary, either it's free, or
it's GAKked, so they (the privacy lobbyists) can't disavow crypto
anarchy, because it's a consequence of the technology and legal frame
work they want for privacy.  There's nothing in between.

My conclusion was that the crypto anarchy conclusions are pretty much 
in line with some of the NSAs scare stories and their spin is being 
used as an argument for GAK.

Adam
-- 
Have *you* exported RSA today? --> http://www.dcs.ex.ac.uk/~aba/rsa/

print pack"C*",split/\D+/,`echo "16iII*o\U@{$/=$z;[(pop,pop,unpack"H*",<>
)]}\EsMsKsN0[lN*1lK[d2%Sa2/d0<X+d*lMLa^*lN%0]dsXx++lMlN/dsM0<J]dsJxp"|dc`

At 2:18 AM -0700 6/26/97, Adam Back wrote:

>So you might argue that this would make the privacy lobyists seem more
>middle of the road.  However crypto is binary, either it's free, or
>it's GAKked, so they (the privacy lobbyists) can't disavow crypto
>anarchy, because it's a consequence of the technology and legal frame
>work they want for privacy.  There's nothing in between.

I of course agree that there's nothing in between, and that free and full
access to strong crypto implies crypto anarchy (in some form, not
necessarily full-blown anarcho-capitalism in all areas).

I don't think massively publicizing crypto anarchy will serve to make the
privacy lobbyists "seem more middle of the road." More likely, if Congress
ever figured out what strong crypto really means, they'd ban it
immediately. And if the Supreme Court ever figured it out, they'd uphold
the ban.

>My conclusion was that the crypto anarchy conclusions are pretty much
>in line with some of the NSAs scare stories and their spin is being
>used as an argument for GAK.

I agree. The NSA, FinCEN, etc., figured out the implications the same way
we did. Maybe nobody in these agencies was very publically trumpeting them,
for various obvious reasons, and maybe not as early as some of us were
(1981-87), but they certainly reached the same conclusions in recent years.

This doesn't mean we're not in a state of war with each other, though.

They know that if we win, they lose. We know that if they win, we lose. Simple.

--Tim May


There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Tim May wrote:

> (By the way, I have no heard no good counters to my point that the "use of
> crypto in furtherance of a crime" is quite analogous to "freedom of
> religion shall not be abridged, but saying a heathen prayer in furtherance
> of a crime shall subject the heathen to an additional five years of
> imprisonment." This is why I think the "use of a special language or
> whispering in furtherance of a crime" provisions of SAFE will probably be
> struck down by the Supremes, unless they, too, have forgotten what the
> Constitution is all about.)

OK, Tim, I'll try:
The use of communication in furtherance of a crime shall add five years .
. .etc.

The use of any device to enhance the speed of communication in furtherance
of a crime shall . . . etc.

The use of any device to disguise a voice in furtherance of  . . . etc.

The use of any cryptographic means of communication in furtherance . . .

Now, if two and three above are constitutional, why aren't one and four?
MacN

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In <Pine.SOL.3.96.970624204553.3935D-100000@cavern.uark.edu>, on 06/24/97 
   at 08:56 PM, Mac Norton <mnorton@cavern.uark.edu> said:

>On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Tim May wrote:

>> (By the way, I have no heard no good counters to my point that the "use of
>> crypto in furtherance of a crime" is quite analogous to "freedom of
>> religion shall not be abridged, but saying a heathen prayer in furtherance
>> of a crime shall subject the heathen to an additional five years of
>> imprisonment." This is why I think the "use of a special language or
>> whispering in furtherance of a crime" provisions of SAFE will probably be
>> struck down by the Supremes, unless they, too, have forgotten what the
>> Constitution is all about.)

>OK, Tim, I'll try:
>The use of communication in furtherance of a crime shall add five years .
>. .etc.

>The use of any device to enhance the speed of communication in
>furtherance of a crime shall . . . etc.

>The use of any device to disguise a voice in furtherance of  . . . etc.

>The use of any cryptographic means of communication in furtherance . . .

>Now, if two and three above are constitutional, why aren't one and four?

Well in my IMNSHO none of the above are constutional.



- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.amaranth.com/~whgiii
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 2.6.3a at: http://www.amaranth.com/~whgiii/pgpmr2.html                        
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

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At 2:02 PM -0700 6/24/97, Eric Murray wrote:
>Tim May writes:

>> It will make many groups _satisfied_ to reach "a compromise we can all live
>> with." The various cyber-rights [sic] groups will probably trumpet this as
>> a victory, as "the best we could get."
>
>They will make it out as a victory ("send us more money") but in
>reality it'll just be a little less of a defeat.

I'd be willing to bet the cyber rights [sic] groups are preparing for the
compromise and their role in the "victory." In this sense, the
McCain--Kerrey bill is almost a godsend to them, as it allows them to forge
a compromise and thus show that they are doing something useful.

>The rejectionist stance has the presumption that, if unwatched, the
>government will pass a law so onerous that the people will rise up
>in protest.  Unfortunately I don't think Americans will rise up in
>protest over _anything_ any more.  Certainly not over basic freedoms.

Well, I know of some Americans who blew up a building filled with Feds.

That ain't exactly doing nothing.

I have to confess to not being completely unhappy with the McCain-Kerrey
thing. By being so much of a Big Brother action, it validates what we've
been warning about.

And while _most_ Americans will not rise up in protest, as you point out,
this will invigorate the extremist factions fighting for collapse of the
entire corrupt system.

(For we extremists, whom some have called "bloodthirsty," there's no better
recruiting tool than such things as McCain-Kerrey. I've heard more of my
friends saying that Congress just ought to be blown up than I ever would
have imagined a few years ago. And this is not a view shared only by
extremists: anyone who saw the coming attraction trailers for "Independence
Day," last year at that time, was probably struck by the visceral and
immediate audience reaction to the scene showing the alien flying saucers
vaporizing and destroying the White House: cheers and clapping throughout
the audience.)

This will be a good thing. Just avoid soft targets, as I keep warning.

--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

Tim May wrote:
> 
> I've heard more of my friends saying that Congress just ought to be
> blown up than I ever would have imagined a few years ago.

This is what I've heard referred to as the "_Debt of Honor_ scenario",
referring to the Clancy book of that name.  In it, an airliner was
crashed into a joint session of congress.

-- 
What is appropriate for the master is not appropriate| Tom Weinstein
for the novice.  You must understand Tao before      | tomw@netscape.com
transcending structure.  -- The Tao of Programming   |

At 11:23 PM -0700 6/24/97, Tom Weinstein wrote:
>Tim May wrote:
>>
>> I've heard more of my friends saying that Congress just ought to be
>> blown up than I ever would have imagined a few years ago.
>
>This is what I've heard referred to as the "_Debt of Honor_ scenario",
>referring to the Clancy book of that name.  In it, an airliner was
>crashed into a joint session of congress.

I dubbed it the "Sato Solution." (As I recall...it's been a while since I
read it...I think Sato was the pilot of the 747. If not this name,
something similar.)

The destruction of the entire Congress, plus a thousand other despots and
sycophants, was inspiring. No doubt the bleeding hearts would moan about
the severed limbs of innocent children and all that. One wonders where they
were when 300,000 civilians were incincerated in Dresden.

Ironic that Tom Clancy is not treated as a "terrorist" for his scenarios.
He supports the mil-ind complex, so he must not be a terrorist. (The same
logic that had George Bush decrying violence and lack of family values in
the film industry...with Arnold Schwarzenegger on the platform with him.)

We need to get beyond the sentimentality of concentrating on the
"innocents" and instead coldly analyze what needs to be done, and then do
it.

--Tim May





There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."