Re: Marc Andreessen on encryption and CDA

My biggest problem is when the pundits (and by extension, those that punt
to them)
frame this entire debate in terms of the Market.  To do so is to argue that
only solutions
that are good for The Market are good solutions; that when a particular
policy is market-agnostic
or market-negative, even though it may be good policy for People (yes,
remember them ???) it is irrelevant or
bad.  This debate is NOT about the Worldwide Encryption Market!


At 05:02 PM 6/30/97 -0400, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>
>Marc Andreessen from Netscape spoke at a National Press Club luncheon on
>June 20. Attached is an excerpt from a transcript of his remarks.
>
>-Declan
>
>---
>
>NATIONAL PRESS CLUB LUNCHEON
>MARC ANDREESSEN, NETSCAPE
>FRIDAY, JUNE 20, 1997
>
>[...]
>
>The goal here in all these markets should be open
>access -- open access for any new competitor who wants
>to offer content and services, who wants to offer
>hardware and software, who wants to offer bandwidth
>for the Net itself. And then open access should also
>allow each consumer and business to choose and buy
>from any set of vendors it wants.
>
>Now, I am not suggesting anything radical -- no major
>new laws or sweeping regulations, but simply that we
>must ensure we have vigorous enforcement first of
>existing antitrust laws and vigorous promotion of
>normal healthy competitive markets in these areas --
>network services, software and hardware, content and
>consumer services. Once we have that, then we need to
>make sure we just don't screw it up. For example --
>just one example -- patently ridiculous limitations on
>the ability of American companies to both produce and
>use encryption software and hardware internationally.
>Encryption technology now is freely available to
>criminals and terrorists all around the world,
>overseas, on the Web. You can buy it from NTT, you can
>buy it from companies out of South Africa, England,
>and many other countries. And we are really at this
>point deluding ourselves with respect to our ability
>to control this technology. The genie is clearly
>already out of the bottle.
>
>However, current regulations, current arms traffic
>regulations that apply to this technology and the new
>McCain-Kerry bill that just was introduced a couple of
>days ago -- the real effect there is that they are
>ceding the international data security market to
>non-U.S. vendors. They are really stunting now the
>development of the Net as a commercial medium, and
>they are leaving American companies fundamentally
>unprotected from economic espionage and terrorism
>abroad. One final example, imposing censorship laws in
>this new consumer content medium that are more
>stringent and restrictive than those on newspaper and
>television.
>
>[...]
>
>
>-------------------------
>Declan McCullagh
>Time Inc.
>The Netly News Network
>Washington Correspondent
>http://netlynews.com/
>
>
>
>

Ah, but what is a market except voluntary transactions between people?
What is good for the market is good for the people.

-Declan

On Mon, 30 Jun 1997 geeman@best.com wrote:

> My biggest problem is when the pundits (and by extension, those that punt
> to them)
> frame this entire debate in terms of the Market.  To do so is to argue that
> only solutions
> that are good for The Market are good solutions; that when a particular
> policy is market-agnostic
> or market-negative, even though it may be good policy for People (yes,
> remember them ???) it is irrelevant or
> bad.  This debate is NOT about the Worldwide Encryption Market!
>

I of course agree with Tim. Corporations are merely voluntary collections
of individuals.

As for civil rights laws: in my dark moments, I want to add a button to my
web page: "Only click here if you are (or are not) Irish." Or "No African
Americans allowed." Or "Nobody over 60 years old permitted." I wonder,
would I be in violation of Title 7?

-Declan


At 08:29 -0700 7/1/97, Tim May wrote:
>Unfortunately, there is a growing distinction being made between "voluntary
>transactions" of _people_ and of _corporations_.
>
>(The most stunning example of this, as Declan of course knows, being the
>"Title 7" stuff in the Civil Rights Act, which takes away a person's right
>to associtate with persons with whom he wishes to associate--he can't
>choose to hire only Chinese, or no cripples, or only Mormons, and so on.)
>
>And in the crypto debate, the term "market" has mostly been interpreted by
>people to mean: Netscape, Microsoft, PGP, RSADSI, C2net, Verisign, etc.
>
>I don't believe corporations have any more rights--or any more
>restrictions--than individuals do. So in this sense I agree with Declan's
>point. But my view is in a minority.
>
>Thus, care is warranted when discussing "market solutions."

At 7:58 PM -0700 6/30/97, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>Ah, but what is a market except voluntary transactions between people?
>What is good for the market is good for the people.
>

I certainly agree with this, if the proper interpretations of terms are made.

Unfortunately, there is a growing distinction being made between "voluntary
transactions" of _people_ and of _corporations_.

(The most stunning example of this, as Declan of course knows, being the
"Title 7" stuff in the Civil Rights Act, which takes away a person's right
to associtate with persons with whom he wishes to associate--he can't
choose to hire only Chinese, or no cripples, or only Mormons, and so on.)

And in the crypto debate, the term "market" has mostly been interpreted by
people to mean: Netscape, Microsoft, PGP, RSADSI, C2net, Verisign, etc.

I don't believe corporations have any more rights--or any more
restrictions--than individuals do. So in this sense I agree with Declan's
point. But my view is in a minority.

Thus, care is warranted when discussing "market solutions."

--Tim May

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."