No Subject

At 05:39 AM 8/22/97 +0200, Boots wrote:
>> The United States has a lot of redistribution of wealth and a lot
of crime.

Elminate it.

> The United States has a lot of lawyers and a lot of crime.

Don't see how you can argue against that one.

> The United States has a lot of guns and a lot of crime.

So?  Actually, we have a lot of handguns, in the hands of criminals,
and even bigger guns in the hand of government terrorist groups like
the ATF, FBI, and the National Park Service.

If we have guns in the hands of responsible people, we have a good
society, armed, secure, and safe, like in Switzerland.

We don't need disarmamant.  We need armed responsible citizens forming
their own militias.  If we had that on a wide scale, we wouldn't need
a professional army.

Guns are neither good nor bad, but what we make of them.  They're
tools, much like plungers, which can be used to unclog a toilet after
visiting a Mexican Restraunt, or to sodomize a suspect.  Use plungers
and guns responsibly, and for good.

GunMonger

At 8:38 AM -0700 8/22/97, Anonymous wrote:

>We don't need disarmamant.  We need armed responsible citizens forming
>their own militias.  If we had that on a wide scale, we wouldn't need
>a professional army.


Here in Santa Cruz, graffiti spray-painted on the walls of businesses is a
big, and growing, problem. And laws require the businesses to paint over
the grafitti, or otherwise render it invisible, in a quick and timely
manner. (The idea is that the grafitti is offensive to the sensibilities of
others, or somesuch, and that it encourages rival gangs to counter with
their own grafitti.)

And yet can J. Random Businessman defend his property against this
defacing? Nope. The cops say "Let us handle crimes." But they don't.

There's a solution for taggers: snipers.

(I'm indebted to Chip Morningstar for this succinct solution.)

This is just one example of how lawlessness comes from the perception that
ordinary citizen-units have been rendered defenseless against predators.

Another example is that of the East Bay rapist, as reported on here by Bill
Stewart. Can women get concealed carry permits in California? Nope. The
cops say, "We don't want citizens armed...let us enforce the laws."

Right, so that woman facing a rapist gets to wait for the cops to arrive,
assuming she survives the rape.

Or she can carry a gun, illegally, and perhaps survive. One more way the
sheep become felons.

(Cops of my acquaintance urge their wimminfolk, wives and sisters and
daughters and friends, to carry guns in their purses., regardless of what
the law says. A cop at the Sunnyvale Rod and Gun Club gave a girlfriend of
mine pointers on how to use her Mauser HSc .380. The law is an ass.)

--Tim May


There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

At 10:45 PM -0700 8/22/97, Bill Stewart wrote:
>At 10:57 AM 8/22/97 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>>There's a solution for taggers: snipers.
>>(I'm indebted to Chip Morningstar for this succinct solution.)
>
>I'm highly opposed to this inappropriate use of excess force.
>Snipers with paint-guns?  Sure.  Snipers with rock-salt guns?  Perhaps.
>Snipers with real bullets?  Sorry, it ain't worth murder.
>
>On the other hand, the parallels between graffiti taggers and
>SPAMMERs are fairly direct...

No, "spam" is like a telephone call or other contact one may not like, but
which is using a legal channel. Like someone knocking on  your gate. (It
may be that many of these contacts are "unwanted." So? By listing an e-mail
address, or a phone number, or placing a buzzer on a gate, one is
essentially saying "Contact me." Some of these contacts, even if
unrequested, turn out to be positive. Some are negative. All are within
legal bounds.

Grafitti is a trespass onto physical property. If someone enters my
property and spray paints my walls, this is criminal.

It shows how overloaded and ambiguous the term "spam" has become when even
a usually careful writer like Bill is equating criminal trespass with
spamming.

(In one of the newsgroups I read, an increasing response to unpopular views
is to call them "spam." Jeesh.)


--Tim

There's something wrong when I'm a felon under an increasing number of laws.
Only one response to the key grabbers is warranted: "Death to Tyrants!"
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
tcmay@got.net  408-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Higher Power: 2^1398269     | black markets, collapse of governments.
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the information superhighway."

At 10:57 AM 8/22/97 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>There's a solution for taggers: snipers.
>(I'm indebted to Chip Morningstar for this succinct solution.)

I'm highly opposed to this inappropriate use of excess force.
Snipers with paint-guns?  Sure.  Snipers with rock-salt guns?  Perhaps.
Snipers with real bullets?  Sorry, it ain't worth murder.

On the other hand, the parallels between graffiti taggers and 
SPAMMERs are fairly direct...


#			Thanks;  Bill
# Bill Stewart, +1-415-442-2215 stewarts@ix.netcom.com
# You can get PGP outside the US at ftp.ox.ac.uk/pub/crypto/pgp
#   (If this is a mailing list or news, please Cc: me on replies.  Thanks.)