Re: Singaporean control freaks & CMR (Re: puff pieces vs tough crypto issues)

Harish Pillay wrote:

>I don't think the "micro management" is at it's worst in Singapore - not by 
>a long shot.  It is true that the Singapore government tries to do so and 
>in a lot of what they attempt, they somehow come out smelling roses.  But 
>they have goofed up royally as well.  
...................................................................


If you don't mind my asking in front of everybody, how do you stand it,
living there?  Do you get very frustrated (it sounds as though you might),
and want to leave for Anguilla?   Do you remind yourself not to litter with
those gum wrappers you're not supposed to have anyway, what do you think
when you're being incentivized to find a sexual partner and produce
children, or to Do This and Not do That or risk painful punishments?  Do
co-workers become critical of each other's petty "crimes", do you feel
opressed all around, or is it not as bad as it seems from here?


    ..
Blanc

Blanc -

Hi.

> >I don't think the "micro management" is at it's worst in Singapore - not by 
> >a long shot.  It is true that the Singapore government tries to do so and 
> >in a lot of what they attempt, they somehow come out smelling roses.  But 
> >they have goofed up royally as well.  
> ...................................................................
> 
> If you don't mind my asking in front of everybody, how do you stand it,
> living there?  

Sure you may ask and I would venture an answer.  Promise me that you will 
answer the same question as to where you live (Pacific Northwest I assume -
ah, how I would love to move back there!).  How do I stand it living here?
I don't really know.  This is my home after all.  Warts and all.  I was born 
here 38 years ago.  When I was born, Singapore was a British Crown Colony 
(as Hong Kong was up until June 30th this year).  In 1963, we joined our 
northern neighbour, Malaysia, and became a state within that country.  In 
1965, we got booted out.  I was 6.  The country was in shambles to say the 
least.  We are nothing but a piece of island about 600 sq km (or 230+ sq 
miles for the metric-challenged Americans :-)), with no natural resources, 
save for a population them of about 1.5M and a great natural harbour.  We 
have a racial mix of 70% ethnic Chinese, 15% native Malays, 10% ethnic 
Indians and about 5% so-called Others.  What holds this cocktail together - 
nothing except for the hope for a better life.  My parents were immigrants - 
they came to Singapore after WWII from India for a better life.  These people 
are willing to put up with "nonsense" to make money and dream to retire to 
their motherlands during their twilight years.

My parents are now Singapore citizens and so are over 3 million others now.
They are not planning on any form of retirement in any other country - this
is their home.  The formula that saw Singapore be transformed from a 3rd 
world dump to a 1st world city is now not valid.  People of my generation 
have seen the transition and now we are able to assert ourselves as full 
citizens of a island city state and are beginning to do so in an increasing 
manner.  The Internet is helping in that direction.

> Do you get very frustrated (it sounds as though you might), and want to 
> leave for Anguilla?   

Yes, I am frustrated at times - aren't we all.  But I can do pretty much what 
I want.  This is not a police state by any definition.  I am able to buy what 
I want, pay for it in any form I choose and generally go about my life as I 
please.  The income taxes are ridiculously low (much much lower than in the
US) and the general standard of living is good. 

> Do you remind yourself not to litter with those gum wrappers you're not 
> supposed to have anyway.

Why would I have to remind myself?  Good habits are all that it takes.  Have
you checked your city's ordinance to see if littering is an offence and the 
penalty it carries?  What is it that just because in Singapore there are 
signs that state the obvious, it immediately becomes a problem?  True, if the 
society is naturally gracious, there is not need for such reminders - but the 
social habits of the populace in earlier days warranted that.  No apologies 
are really needed, but things have to be placed in perspective.  The unfortunate
thing about the international media is that they are always picking bones on 
the most silly of issues and the some of the bozos in the local government 
here have such thin skins that they get very excitable for no reason.

> what do you think when you're being incentivized to find a sexual partner 
> and produce children, or to Do This and Not do That or risk painful 
> punishments?  

Hmm.  This is what I mentioned in a previous post that there are some things
the lobotomized parts of the government does that is shamefully stupid.  Just
laugh it off.  The govt loves to micromanage.  The generation of Singaporeans
who grew up post independence (1965) have been brought up in that sort of
environment.  But, unlike their parents, this post-1965 generation does not
ask how high when asked to jump, but asks why.

> Do co-workers become critical of each other's petty "crimes", do you feel
> opressed all around, or is it not as bad as it seems from here?

Spot on.  It is all a matter of perspectives and type and quality of
information that is being fed.  We need opening of minds and exchange of
information to remove misconceptions.  Sometime in 1989 (I was living in
Seattle then) I was bombarded by e-mail from a chap from somewhere in 
eastern Europe on how I could defend Singapore when there are people starving 
on the streets, libraries without books, children malnourished etc etc.  I 
don't know what he was smoking, but it sure made for a interesting read.   
I sent back a note asking him to clarify what he was saying, to which he 
replied that that was the type of information he was being fed by their 
media.

Perhaps a more balanced perspective of Singapore can be gotten at 
www.sintercom.org.  Open your minds.  No, this is not a god-forsaken place.
It's home and it's livable.  Come visit us.   Buy me some chewing gum, I'll 
buy the beers.

So, now to come back to the first line.  Tell me how you can tolerate living 
in wherever that it you live in?

Regards.
-- 
Harish Pillay                             	  h.pillay@ieee.org
Singapore      *** Ask me about Linux *** http://home.pacific.net.sg/~harish

Blanc wrote:
> Harish Pillay wrote:
> >I don't think the "micro management" is at it's worst in Singapore - not by
> >a long shot.  It is true that the Singapore government tries to do so and
> >in a lot of what they attempt, they somehow come out smelling roses.  But
> >they have goofed up royally as well.
> ...................................................................

> If you don't mind my asking in front of everybody, how do you stand it,
> living there?  Do you get very frustrated (it sounds as though you might),
> and want to leave for Anguilla?   Do you remind yourself not to litter with
> those gum wrappers you're not supposed to have anyway, what do you think
> when you're being incentivized to find a sexual partner and produce
> children, or to Do This and Not do That or risk painful punishments?  Do
> co-workers become critical of each other's petty "crimes", do you feel
> opressed all around, or is it not as bad as it seems from here?

Q: "Why do you beat your head against the wall?"
A: "Because it feels so good when I stop!"

Q: "Why don't you stop beating your head against the wall?"
A1: "It's illegal to stop."
A2: "It goes against tradition/religion/beliefs/society to stop."
A3: "I'll make less money if I stop."
A3: ...ad infinituum...

  I was going to speak my true mind about the Waco tragedy at work,
but I was coming up for a promotion...
  I was going to speak my true mind about the Waco tragedy at the PTA
meeting, but I didn't want it to look like I was supporting child 
molesters.
  I was going to speak my true mind about the Waco tragedy to my 
company bowling team, but most of them are rednecks.
  I was going to speak my true mind about the Waco tragedy to my spouse,
but she would tell her parents my views, and her father, the Sheriff,
is going to lend us the down-payment on a house.
  I was going to speak my true mind about the Waco tragedy to our
children, but they go to a very conservative school, and I don't want
them to rock the boat and destroy their future.
  I was going to speak my true mind about the Waco tragedy...

Q: "If 1984 was so terrible, why didn't Winston just move to another
year?
A: "Duuhhh..."

  "It may be a prison, but it's *MY* prison."
  "I'm thinking of painting the walls chartreuse, do you think it will 
go well with the scarlett bars on the window? (I had to take the bars
out of the windows to sand them, but I put them back in so that the
Warden won't cut off my exercise privileges.)"

TruthMonger